Ex-Cinema and Empathy: In Conversation with Filmmaker Caveh Zahedi – Chris Kelso

March 13, 2026

Akira Lippit’s notion of ex-cinema idealises a space outside a work of art, one which can only be achieved in the Brechtian form. Located by an ‘exergue’, this space remains exterior (but still indispensable from) the body of work itself. These ‘minor inscriptions’ are what give certain works of art their transcendence – they offer something uniquely personal, dated, signed, and addressed to themselves in a single act of self-immortalisation. This notion also presents an interesting new transmission system for empathy and the enrichment of author/audience connection.

Caveh Zahedi is not a household name, yet his unique engraver initials are scrawled across every piece of digressive art he produces. And in each production, Zahedi creates two bodies for his audience, side-by-side – an expressed interior and the surface exterior that give shape and permanence to each other. His frequent detours embody the natural digressions of real life, unpremeditated and largely unscripted. Despite this fairly courageous approach to creation, Zahedi’s work remains critically neglected. His TV series, The Show about the Show is an important example of Brechtian meta-comedy, as is his earlier longer-form projects. So, to call Zahedi a crucial artist in an age of apathy would hardly be an overstatement.

Of course, there is some artifice and agenda in his films. Zahedi never wants audiences to forget they are watching something on a screen, and while his work often urges viewers to assume a cold spectatorship, it is never at the expense of emotional immersion. The fact is that it is impossible not to like Caveh, even when he does things which are morally dubious. Through his natural honesty, Zahedi exposes the interior life of a film – whether he is revealing the stage mechanics of a minimalist set or veering wildly off his original thesis statement. He does all this, I believe, not for the sake of being experimental or weird; but because it is a by-product of his candid methodology of diarist art. Caveh gives us everything – every-single-thing. Every nook and cranny, every humiliation, every moment of arrogance and self-hatred. He makes an example of himself. He gives you his life, unfettered in an act of ultimate artistic empathy.  

CK – Caveh, in many ways I feel like I already know you. You’ve been so honest about your life and offered so much insight into your family relationships, your own neurosis, your sex-addiction, your experimentation with drugs on camera, etc. Do you find people will approach you in a familiar way because maybe they’ve seen your films and feel like there is some projected bond there? If so, is that this an experience you enjoy, or does it ever exhaust you and violate your personal boundaries?

CZ – Yes, totally. I think people do feel they know me but no, I don’t mind it at all. I like it when people come up to me. It’s usually to say kind things. It doesn’t happen often enough for it to be exhausting and, with rare exceptions, I rarely feel my personal boundaries are being violated. The only exception is when I’m on a phone call on the street and someone approaches and starts talking to me even though I’m obviously in the middle of a phone conversation. 

CK – I think it’s odd how sensitive people can contradict their own neurosis. For example, I’d describe myself as an anxious introvert and I find the thought of speaking in front of large groups so counterintuitive to my own survival impulses – yet I’m a teacher and frequently speak in front of hundreds of students a day. You strike me as a similarly sensitive person (albeit much more self-assured), but do you fear judgment? What drives you to put yourself on the line so often?

CZ – I definitely fear judgment but I’m so used to being judged that my fear of it no longer overwhelms my desire to express myself freely. I would also describe myself as an anxious introvert who, like you, is a teacher who routinely speaks in front of large numbers of students. I’ve found teaching to be very freeing in terms of letting go of fear of judgment. Because you know the students are judging you at each and every moment, and often quite harshly. It’s great practice!

CK – The fact you always use yourself as the subject must take a lot out of you. Do you ever think about shifting the focus to just directing or attempt a more straight forward structured narrative?

CZ – It does take a lot out of me but it also gives me a lot. It give me more than just directing or attempting a more straightforward structured narrative would give me. I like a certain amount of risk, and I enjoy challenges, so I get a bit bored if I’m not pushing the envelope to an extent that most people would find untenable.